Guns and shootings in the USA out of control

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Michael Romanos, Jun 12, 2016.

  1. Michael Romanos

    Michael Romanos Active Member Staff Member Moderator

    Here is one telling stat: In just ONE MONTH of any year, the police in the USA have shot and killed more people than the UK (Great Britain) police have shot and killed in their country in almost ONE HUNDRED YEARS.

    There are currently 70 million people in the UK and 325 million people in the USA.
  2. fromperpig

    fromperpig Member

    In Japan, guns are viewed as a "threat" to public safety, therefore, the country's gun laws are extremely rigorous and discriminating. Outside of law enforcement and similar public safety personnel, it is possible for private citizens to own firearms but you must pass a multistage application process that involves, applications, background checks, employment checks, psychological testing, gun safety and operation training and pass a shooting/handling test. Plus, any gun owner must register with local police, provide a sitemap of where the gun is stored and document how it's secured to prevent theft or accidental firing. The process can take anywhere from 6 mos to a year from before permits are given and guns can only be used for hunting, competitions or research purposes. Handguns are allowed but absolutely no automatic weapons are permitted.

    In the US, gun ownership is a right of citizenship (2nd Amendment), thus, Americans relate gun ownership to freedom and liberty. And, because violent crime in America has skyrocketed and guns are so prevalent amongst criminals, most gun owners argue that owning a firearm is the only viable means of self-protection.

    Two vastly different policies on gun ownership by its citizens. Two radically different laws on who can own guns and why...

    In 2015, there were 13, 429 shooting deaths (reported) in the US. In Japan, there were 22 (and the government in pushing for more stringent gun control laws!). A US citizen is 300 times more likely to be shot and killed than a Japanese citizen. A US citizen is 4 times more likely to die from flesh eating bacteria than a Japanese citizen from gun shot. (note: population of the US vs Japan is roughly 3:1)

    Time and again, the United States reacts to mass shootings with a ritual of mourning and expressions of grief for the victims and families. Again and again, American leadership urges it's citizens to grieve, together, for those who lost life but we must stand, steadfast, against hatred and oppression and never allow fear to "win" (because that's what terrorists and murderers want).

    Question: How safe do you feel (fellow Americans)? How many times must we hear the same tired speeches of grief, sorrow and outrage before change is demanded? How many times do we have to hear the same pro-gun argument: Guns don't kill people; People kill people. How long must we wait before we find leadership that will finally speak the truth about guns: Guns don't make us more free or safe. Guns do the very opposite!
  3. Michael Romanos

    Michael Romanos Active Member Staff Member Moderator

    There are up to 32,000 people inside the USA who die from shooting per annum. If you add Japan with Germany, France and Great Britain together in most years you would not reach 60 deaths per annum from guns. Granted that in Japan few suicides are carried out using a gun and in the countries mentioned on the other side of the USA, hunting is either prohibited or there is little of it. Japan, Germany, France and Great Britain have strict gun control laws so when will the USA wake up to their attitudes and ideas.

    Prers Obama speaks the truth about gun control and gun useage and even his watered-down efforts have not been accepted by sufficient others in the senate and congress. No doubt Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders will try twink with present gun control laws and habits in the USA when they fight off the afflicted and flawed Trump but one tends to forget that the Second Amendment of the American constitution is just that - an amendment and it is subject in itself to interpretation.

    Pres Obama also said that the USA does not have a mortgage on mad/insane people But take a look at Trump supporters and they number in the millions. And Trump is a "great" advocate of arming American citizens to the hilt and allowing even freer access to guns and the carrying of guns.

    A dozen years ago or so ago there was a horrific mass shooting in Tasmania, Australia. Australia subsequently greatly tightened up its gun control laws and there has never been another mass shooting in Australia. I am not saying that the USA could emulate this because of inbedded attitudes but a lot could be achieved to stem the flow of lethal killings other wise its going to be more and more of the same.
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
  4. Michael Romanos

    Michael Romanos Active Member Staff Member Moderator

    The indiscriminate shooting and killing of Black Americans by police must stop but how can it with racial undertones and the live by the gun mentality so on one hand nearly every action by a Black American is seen as some kind of threat such as the notion that a gun is going to be pulled out, and on the other hand so many Americans (cops and others) are gun happy and/or gun edgy.

    And we have people like Trump who infers he wants Americans carrying and concealing guns at every situation and at every place. Its almost laughable but it is more than pathetic.
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2016
  5. fromperpig

    fromperpig Member

    I urge everyone to watch a few episodes of "Cops" (bad boy, bad boy, whacha gonna do...wacha gonna do when they come for you?). What you will find on most every arrest: The driver/suspect is stoned, drunk or both! If you live in a good, safe neighborhood, the average American citizen is absolutely clueless how bad the alcohol and drug abuse problem is in high crime areas in America.

    Everybody is high!...Everybody is poor!...&, everybody is desperate and taking insane risks, daily!

    When you mix substance abuse with traffic stops, it's a recipe for disaster. With everyone high and, therefore, impaired, these fools can't follow basic verbal instructions. You yell and scream, "STOP!!!!" They look at you dead-straight in the eyes, then......keep right on with what they're doing, regardless, if they have a service revolver pointed point-blank to their forehead!

    Lastly, because these poor urban ghettos are very dangerous, most of these idiots are packin' (weapons).

    These are unprecedented times, Mike. You New Zealanders cannot appreciate the danger law enforcement officers in the US are exposed to! It is this mixture of high unemployment, educational disparity, latch-key parenting combined with stupidly outdated gun laws and g.!!!!d.!!!! DRUGS and ALCOHOL abuse.

    When bad guys are "packin", impaired and living a very hostile, desperate & unhealthful existence, things that matter to you and I, simply don't mean a thing to these dudes! They've got nothing to lose...........but their lives!

    I have a son in-law whose joining the police force. Starting pay is $75K/year. It is not enough, imo. These men and women are performing invaluable service for our communities! They risk their lives on the streets, everyday. When their shift is up, They have a right to go home at night to their families! Please understand the depth and breathe of the drug problem in America; these are unprecedented times!!!!
  6. Michael Romanos

    Michael Romanos Active Member Staff Member Moderator

    With just over half the year gone, Cops in America have so far killed around 145 Black Americans in 2016. I don't say that many of these are not genuine defensive measures but as we all know, not all by any means. It seems that by and large and unwritten, the police in American have a free licence to shoot and kill just as it seems that all Americans have a free wheeling licence to own and use a lethal weapon or have easy access to obtaining a lethal weapon and these weapons can be of military quality and lethalness.

    The simple fact is the freedom of guns as weapons opposed to the ultra tight restriction of guns. Until the USA sorts this out in favour of the latter, mad people and semi-mad people and drug-affected people and people with serious grudges and people who have been exposed to severe racism, and people with the notion to protect themselves even from an innocent door knocker or a person reaching for his driver's licence or because another person is black or brown, will continue to plaster the USA as an insane killing field.

    That the USA has many millions of its citizens living in such poor conditions and poverty is yet another political problem that can be overcome with a proper welfare system such as what exists in Western Europe and Australia and New Zealand. Ask Bernie Sanders.

    As this is a dog site, there have been many cases where American police have shot and killed innocent dogs. I've heard of two quite recently where the police went to the wrong house and arrested the wrong person and in doing so also killed the arrested persons dogs because the dogs looked like they were menacing. its just along the lines of shoot first and ask questions later, and trigger happy-ness because that.s the way it is in the USA. Some humans might be on drugs that can promote bad and maniac behaviour but the dogs are unlikely to be.
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
  7. Michael Romanos

    Michael Romanos Active Member Staff Member Moderator

    Two classic cases of what the gun laws have done to the mentality of too many poeple in the USA.

    1/ In Ohio it is illegal to carry around in public a toy water pistol or an orange (!!!!) but not openly a lethal firearm - hand gun or rifle.

    2/ A much respected and sober Black American without any weapons of any kind lay on the ground with both arms extended in the air and told the cop calmly and clearly who he was, what he was doing and whom he worked for etc and yet the cop still shot him.

    It's sickening.
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2016

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